Saturday, 11 June 2011
London Slutwalk.
Today's Slutwalk had a good turn out and was lively, noisy and to the point. And of course it was good fun to be in the company of so many charming young women. I especially liked the lady with her basque wearing Staffordshire Bull Terrier. Yes it was good fun but I felt saddened toward the end. Sad that after all these years women still have to struggle for the right to dress how they please and go where they please. Sad also that people my age seem to have produced a generation of young men who have yet to fully grasp that girls are mates and comrades first; and lovers only maybe. Anyway, well done all and thanks for a great day out.
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10 comments:
I can only describe a woman who dresses provocatively in a public or private place and accepts no responsibility for the increased risk of, or actual sexual assault that follows, as delusional. On the one hand please admire and lust after my body but don’t you dare touch me or even think about that. I can tease you as much as I like. It makes me feel good and there is nothing men can do including those men who are dysfunctional around women but who have strong and unsatisfied sexual drives, ie potential rapists. That sounds like a form of baiting, bullying or torture to me. It could also be described as stupidity. I wonder how many more women will be raped directly as a result of being influenced by the slutwalkers, mistakenly thinking themselves a latter day Emily Pankhurst or Rosa Parks?
Benski
Benski are you implying that all men are rapists! That aside did anyone else read Roseanne Barr's tremendous class attack in saturday's guardian magazine! That's my kind of slut!
Hi Gitane
I am not saying that all men are rapists, or that they have the potenial to be. I am simply taking the pragmatic line that there are potential rapists out there, ie men who are sick or damaged or unable to live within the boundaries of normal relationships that will do the unthinkable. No march or publicity is going to stop that and it will not go away. Sorry, did not read the Guardian piece.
Benski
I understand but femininity and provocation are a minefield for men. Women seem to know exactly who they want and why. Of course there are the odd extreme personalities out there but if we follow your argument through how do we deal with paedophiles and our children? Must we vet every man our children come in contact with, do we demand police ( females) escort our children to school? i understand your reasoning but will not accept anything that confines my liberty or anyone elses ; except the rich, erm paedos , gangsters, fascists, rapists etc you see how difficult this is . Fuck it I'm off for a bevvy!
Benski, It's just your type of attitude that brought all those people out in to the streets - not just in London yesterday, but worldwide. To believe that it's reasonable to view women as potentially rapable because they show some flesh is woefully misogynistic. If you have so little control over yourself, the responsibility is for you to get treatment. Women are not trying to "tease" you - that is narcissism. Sex is something wonderful when it's a shared experience, not something you "get" from another. To darkly suggest that women will be raped as a result of flagging up the behaviour of rapists is a crude and ancient attempt at control.
Hi Gitane
My argument is simply that some men cannot handle the ‘provocation’ and that might result in rape, so the smart thing to do is avoid that risk situation. By way of a reality check, last year my (mini skirted) 20 year daughter was followed home off the bus from a night club by a ‘weirdo’ who tried to force his way into her flat. My daughter has since taken action like covering up on the bus and/or arranging lifts with friends. But she still enjoys clubbing so has not forfeited her liberty.
Benski
Hi Elizabeth
My attitude is based on women taking stock of reality and not putting themselves at risk. I think that is a good attitude and hardly constitutes misogyny or narcissism. Your reference to potential rapists seeking treatment is naïve because it just won’t happen pre-attack. I think that some women do ‘tease’ and they do it in part because it makes them feel powerful. That is not a man’s view by the way, it’s what women have told me. As for the marches, they do not add up to a worldwide majority women’s view. I suspect that most women around the world disagree with the slutwalkers, and few would want to be labelled a slut.
Benski
Benski, the fact that you link the incident of your daughter being followed home by a weirdo to her wearing a mini-skirt says more about your moral compass than anything else.
There is no provocation, no teasing, no invitation to sex and no invitation to violence when women choose to dress in a reavealing, sexy, 'slutty' or glamorous manner. I feel no shame in saying that I love to see women in short or tight skirts- a fairly normal position amongst chaps, I'd say- but I feel neither teased nor provoked. I'm usually just quite happy that someone has unintentionally brightened my day up a bit.
You, on the other hand, would see a women in a short skirt as a tease, a bully and a torturer who is stupid and delusional (your words) because she refuses to believe she wanted to be raped. You state in your last comment that women have told you they like to tease in order to feel powerful. I take issue with that as I find it hard to believe that any women have ever spoken to you.
Hi WDI
I know it's difficult for some people not to get hysterical on this subject. My argument is a simple one. It’s that women will put themselves at increased RISK if they dress or act in a certain way in certain situations. That is not an INVITATION to rape and I think we agree that no woman deserves to be raped as a result of any such behaviour or for any other reason. My argument has nothing to do with moral compasses, it's a pragmatic position. You might believe that there is no link whatsoever between the way women might dress and act and the increased risk of an attack. You seem to ignore the fact that there are nuts out there, just like the one who tried to force his way into my daughter's flat. Surely you will agree that if a woman dresses provocatively and even unknowingly teases a potential rapist/weirdo there is an increased chance that an attack will follow? Or do you put your head in the sand and say that those bad men should not do that and women should pretend it's not there? I think it’s a very dangerous message that says ‘it's ok to dress and act as you please any time any place’ because that can only lead to more attacks on women.
I will not respond to your personal attacks on my character except to say that it's surely one of the rules of ‘blogging’ that we all respect another person's view even if we disagree with it. There will be no further comments from me on this subject.
Benski
Benski, there are no 'rules of blogging' and I certainly don't respect views I don't agree with.
But back to the subject at hand, even thoough you've already thrown your dummy out of the pram and refuse to play any more.
There is no corelation between the amount of flesh a woman displays and her likelihood of being raped, no matter how much you would like there to be. Are our beaches and swimming pools a Hellish festival of sexual attacks? No.
You, bizarrely, seem to think rapists are just big dumb brutes wih no ability to resist their massive, manly sexual desires. Have you ever thought about the fact that rape is not about libido?
Regarding your last point, yes; it is OK to dress as you please any time, any place. Your Victorian, misogynistic puritanism would be funny if it wasn't so repellent.
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